00:00:11  Hello everyone and welcome back to The Rave Social Podcast. I’m your host, Jaiden, and today we have Julia. We’re so excited to have her. She is a realtor in Salt Lake City and she’s also a good friend of mine. She’s awesome. And she’s going to talk a little bit today about real estate for self-employed people, what that looks like, what it looks like to be a realtor, how to market yourself as a realtor. We’re going to kind of cover a lot of different topics. But yeah, I think this is going to be a really good episode. And why don’t you tell us a little bit about you, Julia? Yeah. I’m so excited to be here. Thanks for having me. Yeah, I am from Salt Lake City, grew up here, went to school at the U. And worked in corporate as an event planner for five and a half years before I went into real estate. Wow. I didn’t realize you grew up here, which is so cool. Like, I grew up in southern Utah.

  00:01:00  So there’s a lot of things about Salt Lake that I just that were new to me. Like, even still, I mean, I’ve lived here for almost ten years, so I’m starting to get the hang of it. But I remember when I moved here, I was like, the city is enormous and it’s only gotten bigger. It’s crazy, though, because when I was growing up, I grew up in, like, Sandy Draper. Yeah. So to go past Murray was like a trek. To go downtown was like an adventure. And then when I was up at the you same thing like going to SugarHouse was so far like, I feel like everything about Utah is like, if it’s further than 15 minutes, it’s really far. So for other places it’s like 40 minutes is far. But now I’m driving all around the state all the time just for work, and so I feel like I’m a lot more accustomed to just a different areas in what’s there and stuff. Then my little bubble that I was in growing up here.

  00:01:52  So yeah, it is interesting. And it’s also funny, like because my podcast has ranked in Canada high, Canadians love you guys so much. Hey, but it’s funny because I feel like the US and specifically Utah is like the only place where we like, measure things. By time. We’re like, yeah, that’s four hours away. That’s five hours away. Like everywhere else. People are like, that’s 300 miles or kilometers or whatever away. And so like when you say it, I think people are like, what do you mean? You measure things in time? I always measure things in time. Me too. It just makes sense. I don’t care how many miles away it is. That’s what makes sense to me. Yeah. I think it’s the difference of, like, probably living in it, like really metropolitan areas versus, like, it would take four hours to get from like one side of New York to the other if you were to drive it. But like in Utah. You can go from the top of the state to the bottom.

  00:02:42  So it’s just interesting. So yeah, why don’t you tell us a little bit how you got into real estate? Yeah. So like I said, I was in events for like five and a half years, corporate events. And before that I got my degree in strategic communications. So it was like marketing, social media, graphic design business, which was super helpful during events. Right? Because similar to real estate events, it’s like you’re marketing one thing and it’s like there’s a timeline, there’s a budget, there’s a goal. And so anyways, I love doing events. Did that for a long time. I switched jobs in 2020. I started my job and was there for three days. And then the pandemic started and I had worked like so hard to become like an event manager. And I was so excited to, like, start at this new company and like, do all these awesome events. And then basically what happened was I pretty much became like an executive assistant office manager. No events because there was no events.

  00:03:46  And I mean, I was lucky that they even kept me on, but I just felt like I didn’t work this hard to just, like, have it all stop. And so I started to think like, what could I do? I really didn’t know if events would come back, how they would come back. And so I just kind of like stepped back and looked at my skills and was like, okay, I like helping people. I’m really organized, you know, I’m like, feel like I’m like deeply rooted in the community. And I just like being with people. Like relationships is like a big thing to me. And so I was like, well, maybe real estate and and I feel like there was a lot more crossovers to there was a time where I like, thought I was going to get into interior design, and we had like a photo studio at Overstock, where I worked for a long time, and I did like a mentorship over there. And then my mentor there taught a class at Slick and Design Psychology, which is all about like how spaces affect us and how we can manipulate our spaces to, like, make us feel a certain way.

  00:04:48  And it all just I felt like everything just led me to real estate, like very organically. And obviously there was like a whole new set of like terms and like rules and all these things that I had to learn. But it it’s still like the structure of it was so similar to an event. A client’s going to come to me with a budget, a goal, a timeline, and I’m going to like, project, manage that and market it that, and then just nurture that relationship and then nurture relationships with all, like my vendors too. So it’s just kind of grown pretty naturally, and it’s always felt pretty natural, I think, because of all the things that led me to it. So that’s so crazy. My last podcast episode was with Aubrey, who is a photographer, and she was like, yeah, I had this huge career going. And then 2020 hit and everyone canceled all of their weddings. She was a wedding photographer and she’s like, and then I was like, oh no, what am I going to do? Like.

  00:05:42  And then she ended up shifting into stock photography, which is awesome. And it’s very similar to like what you did. You were like, I’m in this industry and there are crossovers between this and like real estate. So I’m just going to shift, you know, like into something else that can suit my skills, which is so cool. Like, that was such a scary time. And to be able to just shift like that just shows like how resilient you are, and it’s just amazing to see it. It was such a weird time, but like, my job wasn’t very engaging and so I had so much time to, like, start taking my coursework. And honestly, I was just I was so bored at that job. It felt so lifeless. And it was like, yeah, I was making okay money and I had a job, but I was like, I need more. And I feel like my cup gets filled from helping people, and I just needed that to happen again. And so and people were like, way buying houses.

  00:06:33  Yeah, well, not with me, not with because I wanted a baby. Well, because no one wanted to buy a house with someone that wasn’t super experienced because it was so like every market that I’ve been in, there was like, oh, this is the worst market it’s ever been. And I’m like, like since I’ve been in real estate. But when I started, it was like, I mean, people were putting in 30 offers on houses. And so it was really hard for me to get the trust of clients and like, build up that network. Yeah, when I first started out, and actually most of my first clients were previous coworkers because people already had that. People were already like, oh well, I’ve worked with Julianne. I know her work ethic and it’s she’s doing a new thing, but I know that she can do it for me. So a lot of my like first transactions and stuff were with coworkers. Yeah, that is so cool. It just shows like the power of a network for sure.

  00:07:24  I’ve always, like, tapped into my network. Every job I’ve ever gotten was because of somebody that I knew. You know, I never I’ve never gotten a job from applying to one on LinkedIn. Like, no ever. Especially always gotten. Yeah. Referrals. My first job, I worked at the hospital. My sister referred me there. My next job, I worked at a marketing firm who a girl I went to CrossFit with referred me to my job. After that, you know, it was just like I’ve always been connected. And I think that’s so important in marketing. Like people actually really underestimate the value of a of a real life network in marketing. But it’s so huge. And not even that. But it’s like you are your personal brand. And so it’s like, that’s what gets you jobs. That’s what grows your business and stuff. Whether people look at themselves as a personal brand, even if they work for a corporation or not, or they’re an entrepreneur, I feel like still there is a brand that you’re reflecting to people in on the outside every time you’re interacting with them on social media, and that affects what comes or doesn’t come your way, you know? Yeah, I’ve said that before on this podcast that like, you have a personal brand, even if you don’t think that you do, it’s how your friends and your family and your coworkers perceive you that is your personal brand.

  00:08:37  So like, you do what you want with that. But like, I feel like personal brands are just that is the future. Like people want to know you on an individual level. Like I don’t want to hire somebody that I don’t know know. And people just hire people that they like, like, yeah, of course, skills are like a big part of it, but whether it’s hiring a realtor or hiring someone, a full time employee, it’s like those are end up being the people that you spend the most time with, and you want it to be somebody that you enjoy spending time with. And I feel like a lot of times that’s just what it comes down to. That’s so true. We can talk a little more about that too, in a little bit when we talk more about marketing. But before we get into that, I know there’s a lot of people. In fact, like most people listening to this podcast are like self-employed. They’re either freelancers or agency owners or things like that.

  00:09:23  And I feel like buying a house is so scary to people who are self-employed because it’s a little bit of a different process. So can you tell us a little bit about that and how to be prepared? Yeah, I think if it’s something that you’re hoping to do in the next year, like talk to a loan officer now and a good loan officer should be able to tell you what your income needs to show for the house that you want to qualify for, because a lot of times, Us self-employed folks want to write off as much as we can so that we pay less in taxes. But that can affect your ability to qualify for the purchase price or the house that you would want to buy. So definitely just start with the loan officer early and get those conversations going. Another thing to keep in mind is they want to see two years of employment at your business or you being a contractor, whatever it is in that, that that income is consistent. Another tip is if you have a car payment or a car that you use for your business to have it be paid for through a business account, that can just help you when you’re qualifying.

  00:10:31  A couple of other things that can help. You are having a cosigner of someone that isn’t self-employed, so someone that is a W-2, just because their income is going to look a lot more steady? Yeah, it’s like steady stable. And then having like a bigger down payment is always going to help too. But they’re looking at your debt to income ratio. And so just planning a little bit out and knowing that you might need to make some adjustments if you don’t qualify now. And I would also say to get a second opinion and to work with someone who helps a lot of self-employed folks, there’s a lot of loan officers that that’s not really there, like bread and butter. So they might say, oh, you can’t do it. And you feel like you all of a sudden can’t buy a house, but then somebody else might have some creative ways to help you get in. And it’s so funny you said that. I think people are scared, and I think it’s for all those reasons. But some people are like, well, what if my business slows down? What if this, what if that? And I always think about like, there’s so many people that I know that are unemployed right now, like having a full time job isn’t always steadier than being self-employed.

  00:11:34  It’s honestly almost riskier to be like employed because you have no idea. Like at least in my business, I can forecast, I can see like, oh, this is my income for the next six months. I know because I have clients and contracts. Certainly like that is income I will have. And like with a job you could just lose it the next day. I think about that all the time and especially like these last two years, like I feel more steady into my employment working for myself because I know that I’ll get back what I put in, where a lot of people that work, corporate jobs work so hard and you’re just a number and you could get laid off any day. And it’s like, is that more stable than working for yourself? I think it depends on what industry you’re in, for sure, and how much money you can make. But I don’t know. That’s just something that I think about your personality, you know, like it definitely depends on your how like risk tolerant you are as a person.

  00:12:30  Totally. And how uncomfortable you’re willing to be. I think that’s a huge thing with just entrepreneurship in general, like just normalize being really uncomfortable, because a lot of times that’s how it is. Like it’s uncomfy. But I agree with you. Like it does feel a little more secure because you can forecast out a little bit and you develop all these skills as an entrepreneur and a business owner that you can do. So like you can pivot all the time, like you could easily pivot into interior design because of what you’re doing. And so like when there’s ups and downs in different markets, like you can shift a lot quicker, then I feel like you can if you’re a full time employee, which also like I value that too, because my fiance is a W-2 employee. And I also appreciate that because I’m like, yeah, you have that on lockdown. Like you’re the guy who’s going to help us qualify for a house, like all of that kind of stuff. And then there’s me who can like go be an entrepreneur.

  00:13:20  So I think there’s definitely a value in both. But yeah, and it’s not for everyone. But yeah, I definitely think it’s just nice to know, like, okay, I can put in what I want and I’ll get that, I’ll see that come back to me. But it is not for everybody, that’s for sure. No, but that was really, really helpful. And now I feel like we can shift a little bit more into like, becoming a real estate agent and like, developing your personal brand. So what is the importance and the value of having a personal brand as a realtor? This might be a hot take, but I think most realtors are so boring and like give me the ick. I mean, seriously, like if I go to most real estate pages, it’s just copy and paste. It looks like it was just stock images, like there’s no life there. And it’s like, that doesn’t work for me. That’s not going to be part of my brand. And the people that are showing up that way, you’re not getting business from that.

  00:14:15  I feel like when I started, I felt like I had to like act a certain way and dress a certain way, and like, if I did all those things, then I would be successful. And it just it wasn’t authentic to me. And I felt like people saw that. And when I started to, like, dress more myself, not like less professional, but less like classic professional, like I wasn’t wearing a suit, but like, I don’t know. And just showing up in a way that felt more me. I felt like clients just started to be a lot more attracted to me, and it was easier for me to like, attract clients that I really like to work with. I think having a personal brand is super important, and and it’s not just how you shop on Instagram, it’s what you do for people. I think events is a big part of it. Emails I send a lot of mail. Marketing is just like whatever I can do to support people. But yeah, I think that your personal brand is a big part of why people hire you, especially as a realtor.

  00:15:13  People hire someone that they know, like, and trust. And so if I help someone that had a really good experience, they’re going to send other people, other people my way, like most of my business, is just referrals. So a little bit of social media and a little bit for my marketing. But I’m not someone that door knocks or cold calls or does some of those more, I guess, classic real estate tactics. I just lean into the people that I like, that like me. And that’s a big part of it. And when I first started to, I had like such a wide net and now it’s like, no, I just want to put in like a smaller group of people that it’s just really authentic. Like, these are the people that I want to show up for. And it just it will naturally just like come back to me. It’s really scary. I think for people in any industry to actually do attraction based marketing, everyone wants to do it. But when it comes down to it, it’s scary because if you’re attracting people, you’re going to be repelling people.

  00:16:12  And when people don’t like you or don’t want to work with you, that can be hard to stomach. Especially if you’re hungry for business, you know? But at the end of the day, if you can hold out and get comfortable with people not liking you and not wanting to work with you, then you will find the people that like, really, genuinely do want to work with you. And that’s so important because if you work with people who don’t want to work with you, it’s tragic. I’ve done it and it’s a battle. It’s not like a good exchange of energy. And I think now I’m at the point this year, I came to the point where it’s like, I don’t have to just be a good fit for them. They need to be a good fit for me. And I know what boundaries to set and like. I’m very like system based. So if someone comes to me and they’re like, hey, I want to buy or sell, I’m like, okay, this is what the process is going to look like.

  00:16:59  This is where we start. And if they’re like, no, I want to do this, I want to do this. It’s just telling me that they’re not serious and they’re not respecting my time. And so I can get those indicators pretty quickly. And because of that, you know, like earlier there was this year, this girl was like, I just want to see houses. I just want to see houses. And I’m like, you need to get pre-approved. I don’t want to just blindly show you houses that I don’t even know if you can afford. She’s like, no, I’ve got a great job, I totally can. And I’m like, yeah, but I don’t know that that’s great that you’re telling me, but I don’t even know you. And so she just kept saying, well, let’s just go see more houses. And I’m like, we need to get you pre-approved. We need to do the buyer consultation. I want to make sure that I have a good understanding of what you’re looking for.

  00:17:40  And she’s like, well, I’m not going to do that. And so I was like, okay, I’m not going to work with this person. And so I’m not going to show you houses. Yeah, I’m like, I’m going to set the boundary. So I was like, okay, I actually don’t have time to take you on as a client, but you can work with my assistant and I will be part of the process. And she’s great. And she’s like, oh, well, I’m actually going to work with somebody else. And I’m like, well, you asked me to show you a house tonight, like so. It’s so weird. Sometimes the rejection is hard. Not that that was rejection, but it’s like, if you’re not willing to be a part of my process, I know you’re going to waste my time. And I would rather figure that out early in the process than not. And so I think, too, I’m getting to the point where I’m like, there’s a lot more power in saying no to things and saying yes and knowing what things to say yes and what things to say no to.

  00:18:30  Oh my gosh, that’s like the craziest thing ever. And like, it’s hard for a lot of people. It was so hard for me. I just I just recently figured out how to say no. I did a podcast episode on it, but I was like, just saying yes to so many things. And I think it came from a place of like I was so hungry for like friendship and connection and whatever, because I didn’t have that. So I would just say yes to everything, every client, every opportunity, everything. And like there’s value in that. But then I got to a point where I was like, I’m dreading my life. I’m dreading waking up because not only do I have work, but I have all these other commitments that I’ve said yes to that I don’t want to do. And that affects your job, it affects your clients, it affects everyone. And so like, you have to be able to say no, because imagine you take on that client and she’s like, yeah, show me this house.

  00:19:16  You show her ten, 20, 30 houses and you’re still working with all of your other clients. Like you can’t give your other clients that energy because you’re giving it to that girl who doesn’t care or respect, or I could be missing out on someone who is this amazing client like. Yes. And I think it’s just there is a season to say yes to things, but it’s knowing what to say yes to. Like, I feel like right now there’s just like a bunch of things that I’m excited about and I’m like, I’m gonna try this out. I’m gonna start saying yes to these things and start saying no to these things. I feel like when I’m intuitive and do that stuff, like I get rewarded really quickly. Oh yeah, I’m a big manifester. And so anyone that’s into manifesting, it’s just picturing something as if it’s already there and just knowing that that’s the only reality. And so I’ll do what’s called like scripting and write stuff as if I already have it. And it’s crazy. The more specific I get, or even if it’s more vague, those manifestations start to come true, like so quickly.

  00:20:17  Oh my gosh, it’s so crazy. I know, it’s just I love that the reward actually does come when you are intuitive and like trust yourself. Yes, it’s so crazy. I’ve always been a manifester to like my entire life. That’s one thing that my mom taught me. I grew up really religious, but she still really taught me about like the universe and manifesting, which I loved. And I always like, tell my partner I’m like, anything I’ve ever wanted. I’ve gotten like I’ve never had to tell myself no. Which that sounds really privileged and entitled, but I’ve worked my ass off to get there. Like, I’ve been like, I want this car. I will do whatever to earn the money to get it or whatever, you know what I mean? Or like I want this relationship. Like, it’s so funny because I manifested our relationship and different things like that. And you can manifest it in your business too. So easy. Like I’ve manifested dream clients. Yeah, yeah.

  00:21:12  My dream work day. You know, I’m still refining that a little bit because I’m like. I’m always like, wanting to work more for some reason, but you really can do it. Yeah, I know I manifested my relationship to. We’re both engaged. Look at us. Yeah. So cute. Well, and I think you hit the nail on the head. It’s like people that don’t know what they want don’t get it. And if you know what you want and you know, like that, you’re deserving of it, Then you get the things that you want, and it’s not just because you want it, you’re working towards that. And so subconsciously, like all the movements and all the things that you’re doing, are moving you towards your like, highest and best self and like your dream life. And I always say it’s like, yeah, I can have my dream life. And especially as an entrepreneur, I feel like there’s just so much flexibility to like, have your dream life, because I don’t know, one thing I’m just so thankful for is like, if something is not working, I can just pivot.

  00:22:06  Like all the time. I think about when I was in corporate, it was like, okay, I have this idea, okay, I have to talk to my manager about it. They need to talk to the director. They need to talk to the VP. Can we do it? Is there budget? And it’s like, if I know that there’s money in my business account, if I have the idea, I can just start and I can just find the people to collaborate with. And I just love that. I can make my dreams my reality all the time. And it’s like, like I said, I think a lot of people can think that real estate is really boring, but I can host events, I can do all these things that like make it me and make it fun. Yeah, and your events are so fun. I loved the Valentines that you did. Yeah, it was so fun. It’s fun. So let’s talk a little bit about what it’s like to buy in this market.

  00:22:49  And then I feel like we can even connect that into how to manifest, like your dream house, because, oh yeah, I feel like it’s a great time to buy before the end of the year. I think between now and December is going to be a great time to buy. Interest rates are at the lowest that they’ve been in a year. They’re continuing to drop. There’s tons of houses to choose from and there’s a lot of flexibility because of that. You can negotiate a better price. You can negotiate a credit to pay for closing costs or to buy down your interest rate even more, or ask the seller to make more repairs. Just every time I help people in Q4, they win. All my buyers win. Really? And it doesn’t mean that sellers can’t win too. But if their house isn’t like the best house, then they should probably wait till spring. But I think the market’s going to really turn come spring and get a lot more competitive because interest rates are dropping. So if you have the flexibility, I think between now and December is going to be a good time to get a good deal if that’s something that’s important to you.

  00:23:54  Yeah. What are people surprised by? I’m curious about that. Like if you’re saying you should buy in Q4, what are some things that people are generally surprised by so they could prepare themselves for that? I think something that surprises people about buying and selling is that it really becomes all consuming. Like if you’re getting your house ready to sell, then people are coming to look at it all the time like it has to be clean. And like, I posted a video on my Instagram last week, like, I went over to a client’s house in the summer and they’re like, we want to get our house up as soon as possible. I’m like, you can’t sell it the way it is. There was like piles of stuff everywhere and like dents in the walls. And it takes a while to get your house ready? So definitely talk to me or your trusted real estate professional about like what you should do to get your house ready, because, I mean, you might want to do a bathroom and you’ll get 25 extra grand for the sale of your house.

  00:24:48  Just small things, but. And then for buyers, I mean, you could be out every weekend, and sometimes you have to go right when the house is listed to go get in and make. So I think it just becomes really all consuming. And so not that people don’t buy and sell in busy times of life, they totally do. But just kind of know, like this is going to be a priority and it might kind of take over a little bit. Yeah. Yeah, that’s super interesting. So then why don’t you tell us a little bit how to manifest that. Like how would you recommend somebody tries to manifest their house? I think it’s kind of like a mix of like manifestation and psychology. So like I’ll always do like a buyer consultation with my clients before we go out and look. And one of the questions that I ask him is like, what’s your dream home? Explain it to me like, what’s the floor plan? Is there natural light? Is it brick? Like, tell me everything that you can think of that you like about houses.

  00:25:42  And a lot of first time homebuyers I work with, they’re like, well, I can’t get my dream house. I can’t afford it right now. And I’m like, no, you probably can’t, and that’s okay. But you explaining what’s important to you and like, what makes it a dream house to you? I bet we can recreate or find a lot of elements that will make it be your dream house. And I think people need to realize, like, when I bought my house, it was a shithole. It wasn’t my dream house, but I’ve made it my dream house, and now it looks like my Pinterest board. And so to just kind of give yourself grace that like, you need to have the imagination that you can make anything your dream house, as long as the bones are good, which again, is kind of like an a realtor term, but like I’m talking like, okay, does it have the garage? Are the bones good? Does it have a yard you can work with? Is the floor plan work for you like number of bedrooms, whatever.

  00:26:31  But one thing that I was asked people to think about is a lot of times we’re trying to like, recreate spaces that we had a lot of, like fond memories in growing up. So whether that’s like your grandparents house or the house that you grew up in, I feel like a lot of people subconsciously are trying to recreate that space. Like, I just want this grand room. I need to have a fireplace, I want a trampoline, I want a sun room. And so when I say that to people, a lot of times, like, all these things flood in and they’re like, oh yeah. And it’s funny, like, I’ll help people buy houses and they’re like, this is the exact same floorplan as the house that I grew up in. Or they’ll say stuff like this. This looks just like the house that I grew up in. And it’s really cool to have people make that connection, to help people make that connection. Because like I said, with manifesting, a lot of the things that you’re manifesting were already there.

  00:27:21  And so knowing that it is possible, but you need to kind of be creative. I mean, if your budget is for maybe like a condo. Maybe there’s going to be less flexibility there. If you’re like, I really want a yard or things like that. But I think just being flexible and knowing that it doesn’t happen overnight, but you can slowly make your dream house to as long as it has some of those elements. So like you’re taking a step towards your dream house to buy, maybe buying whatever house like one. One of these houses that’s available to you now could be like a stepping stone to getting into your dream house. So I think that also like that’s part of manifestation too. Is that like there’s sometimes steps, there’s little journeys you’re going to go on that are getting you closer to where you want to be, even if it’s not exactly what you dreamed of this second, it’s like you’re on your way. You’re going to get there totally. And some people might not ever make it to their dream house.

  00:28:19  And that’s okay. Or maybe it’s your third house. And so I think just being flexible with yourself, but knowing that even getting into a house and knowing that that’s doing something and doing something good, that that’s like moving the needle for you to get to your dream house. Yeah, I love that. I also loved what you said about the psychology of buying a house that made me even consider like, oh, what? Because I’m like, what the heck? Like, I love these little I don’t even know what they’re called, but I love the neighborhood that I live in. My favorite neighborhood. Yeah. It’s insane. Like, it’s hard for me because we’re renting and I’m like, the house is here. Just definitely dream home status. You know, it’s going to take a second to get there. So I’m like, I just guess I’m renting forever because I love this neighborhood. But it’s funny when you said that because I look at these houses and I’m like, why do I love them so much? And then it’s not my child at home, it’s my grandparents.

  00:29:10  Like they’ve always lived in, like these beautiful brick homes, not necessarily this style, but these beautiful, like, reddish brick homes. And that’s where all my best memories were made, you know, as a kid. So it’s. Yeah, there’s something psychological magical about it, you know, like space has such an impact on how we feel. Being productive, feeling energized. Feeling safe. And you know, like I said, there’s so many things that you can do to manipulate your space to feel those things. And if you can’t feel safe at home, where can you feel safe? You know what I mean? And that’s why recreating something that’s felt magical, you know, in the past can be really settling and just make it happier to be home. Yeah. Oh my gosh. It’s like so crazy because it’s true. Like, I’ve lived in neighborhoods that were not very safe in Salt Lake before. And there’s just a sense of like, I don’t like, want to call this my home, and I’m not totally in love with it or attached to it because, like, I truly I don’t feel like totally safe here.

  00:30:19  And then when you do live somewhere where you do feel safe, you just show up differently in your life and in your business and everything. You’re just like, oh, I’m taking care of. So like, now I’m able to do what I want. Yeah. And I think even on top of that, one thing I think about, like before we bought our house, we rented a townhome and then I was in an apartment with a friend. But before that I moved five times in one year and it was just so unsettling. I didn’t feel like I could ever get grounded. I didn’t feel like I could relax because I was like, well, what am I going to have to pick up and move? And a lot of that was just like life. I broke up with an ex that I was living with, lived with my brother. He gave me the boot, moved it with my mom like it was just, you know, it was many, many moves and stuff. But I feel like that is the really nice thing about either finding a great rental or buying a house is it’s like, okay, I can stay here, I can set up shop, I can paint the walls, I can buy furniture that fits this space, and I can make it my own and make it cozy and like, find peace here, because that year where I was always on the go, it just didn’t feel like I really had a space because I didn’t.

  00:31:27  And I was like, I didn’t even really want to make it home because I knew I didn’t want to stay some of those places. Yeah. And now being in our house that we bought, it’s like there’s still so many projects and stuff that we want to do, but each little thing that we do, I’m like, it feels more us, it feels more homey, it feels more just good. And I think you just, like, value the space too, when like you get to do that, like when you get to be comfortable, make yourself comfortable. All of that. Like you value it more this weekend, actually, my fiance was gone into like I use this is my office that I’m in. And like I hadn’t set up my podcast studio yet. I hadn’t set up this and I’d just been doing it in this little corner, and I just kind of hated it and didn’t even want to record a podcast, ever, because I was like, I just don’t like it. And then this weekend I just put it all together.

  00:32:17  I was like, whatever, I’m going to organize it. Like, I’m gonna set it up. I’m going to hang my pictures on the wall, put it where I want it, and now I’m like, I love it, and I want to spend Time in this space. And again, like that makes you show up differently in your business, in your life and everything that you do. It’s so impactful. It’s what spaces we’re in, I feel like affect us just as much as the people we spend time with. You know, you either feel happier and more productive or maybe like depressed or like for me, when I’m in really messy spaces, it feels really like chaotic. And I have more anxiety where if you’re in like a more clean space, sometimes spaces are too clean and you feel anxious because of that too. Like, am I in a doctor’s office? Yeah, if you think about it, you’re actually already manifesting your dream house because you’re already living in the neighborhood you want to be in.

  00:33:06  Because if you’re renting, you know what I mean? Because you’re walking those streets every day, looking at the houses, living in a house in that neighborhood, like you’re already like doing all the visualization to be like, this is where I live. This is my life. I’m successful. Whatever. Like positive thoughts that you know, one day you are going to own a house there 100%. And who cares if you’re renting there now? You’re still in that neighborhood. Yeah, that’s such a awesome way to put it in frame. And I do feel that way. I’m like, I feel like the areas you’re in and who you surround yourself with, like, totally elevate your life on a subconscious level when you’re like, this is normal. This is normal for me to live in a nice neighborhood. It’s normal for me to live in a tidy house. It’s normal for me to live in a beautiful space that becomes your reality. It just naturally does over time. So yeah, I love that so much.

  00:33:59  I know it’s perfect. One of the questions we had was, how do you handle rejection, which is so big for like there’s so many people listening to this podcast that deal with rejection on a daily basis. So how do you approach that in real estate? Two things you have to do well a couple things you really have to be a self-starter. You have to be flexible because there’s a lot of no’s. And it might not always be a big no. But like I’m getting rejected constantly. Whether it’s me texting someone eight times and they don’t respond to me that’s getting rejected, or they decide to work with someone else or whatever happens. When I first started, all the rejection hurt so much more. Like if a friend didn’t work with me, I was devastated and it was so hard. And I’m sure that you felt that way too. And now I’m at the point where sometimes working with friends is actually a lot harder, and I don’t know if that’s who I want my primary client to be, because it’s harder to set boundaries.

  00:34:58  But on the rejection thing, I think it’s just knowing like that wasn’t for me, that wasn’t meant for me. And like, that is a way that I can kind of like make peace with it. I’m not for everyone and everyone’s not for me. And people have to say no to me, just like I have to say no to them. And that leads to the right things coming my way, opportunities and people. And it doesn’t mean that the rejection doesn’t get me down. It does. And especially if you’re like on a losing streak and it’s just like, bam, bam, bam. It sucks. It does. It sucks so bad. But you can’t let the some of your rejection define like who you are or how successful you are. It’s just a moment and I think to just trying to like learn from those moments instead. And if there is an opportunity for me to ask for feedback if something goes wrong or I get rejected to actually take that feedback and say, well, what can I learn from this? Or like, what can I do better moving forward and actually be thoughtful about it? There’s sometimes you just have to take it with a grain of salt.

  00:36:03  But in real estate, there’s just like crucial conversations. I don’t know if you’ve read that book, I haven’t, but I’m so curious. It’s really good. It’s just like preparing for like, high stakes conversations, which that could be something with a partner, could be like a negotiation, it could be something with a client. And so many of my conversations are our high stakes and I’m going to have to deliver bad news. I will get to deliver good news too, but just remembering that there’s only so much that’s in my control, and I can take accountability for my mistakes. But I don’t need to apologize for things that are out of my control. Yeah, and I think when you’re young, you’re taught like, yes is good, no is bad. Like in your childhood as you’re growing up, a lot of times you’re told no to protect you or because that’s bad or not allowed or whatever. And then as you get older, it’s hard to like reframe that to be like, no isn’t bad just because someone tells me no, does it mean that that’s bad or I’m bad or whatever is bad? Like no doesn’t equal bad.

  00:37:04  No can also be neutral. It can just be an exchange like, no, I’m yes. Going in a different direction. That’s a beautiful thing. You know, it doesn’t always have to be that it’s bad. And yes, it’s good because, I mean, I’ve said yes to things that are bad, but for two, you know, like you get a yes and you’re like, oh God. Like, I know there’s been times where, like, I’ve sent proposals to clients that I didn’t really want to work with. And then they said yes. And I’m like, oh, you’re like, now I have to do this. No, we have to work together. Luckily, I love all my clients, so that’s not a thing anymore. But at the beginning of my business, that was more of a thing because it was like I just needed the business. I needed to get the experience, I needed to get off the ground. So I did a lot of that. But yeah, it’s I think a little bit of reprogramming that rejection isn’t always negative.

  00:37:52  I would say like it’s usually not negative, honestly, especially if you’re willing to take feedback. I agree, and I think there is something about like building resilience and grit and kind of building a tough skin. Like just because I’m not for someone doesn’t mean that I’m not good at what I do. It doesn’t mean that I’m bad, it doesn’t mean anything negative it like. And I might not ever even know the reason why that no came my way, but just making peace with that. It might not even be about me. And that’s okay. Yeah, I think even a lot of times it’s not about you or whatever. Like when people say no to working with me, a lot of times I’m like, I definitely have a role like I’m accountable for to a degree, and I have a role in this, but a lot of times I’m like, that’s just not what’s best for them. And like, how dare I want them to do something that’s not the best for them? That’s crazy 100%.

  00:38:49  And that comes into my business a lot too. Like I’m the type of agent that it’s like, if it is a good time for you, if you can afford it, if you’re stoked, let’s go. Like where I would say a lot of agents are very like pushy, like, let’s make it work. Let’s push you over your budget. Let’s write it up like very intense. And I’m like, I don’t want to push something on someone that’s not for them. If it is great, and I’m so happy to be a part of your team and like, let’s go, this is amazing. But if it’s not, Who am I to, like, push something that isn’t for you? Because it benefits me. Like that’s just not the way that I’m going to run my business. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs will because they just make it about them. But I just feel like it’s not really about that. And if you always put the client first, it will always just come back to you because you, like, did the right thing.

  00:39:41  That’s just so true in all of marketing. And all of business is like, you really cannot come from a selfish place at all. Like it just won’t work. And it may work for a quick win, but that’s not going to feel good to you, and it’s not going to feel good to that client. And they’re not going to want to have a long term relationship with you. And like, I’m a little bit woowoo even to the degree where I’m like, and then that money is not like good money. Like that money has bad energy, like it literally does, you know? So yeah, I just think it’s important to come from a place of service and really just be that, like honest person for them to come to. Like if you come to me for social media and you’re not in a place for it, like I’m not going to tell you to do it. I tell people no all the time, like, you’re not ready for that investment or you don’t have the time to invest in that right now.

  00:40:34  You should do something else. Yeah. And I, I like what you said about the energetics. Like I feel like everything is an exchange of energy like good or bad. And so just focusing on the good energy and a lot of that like has been the theme of our conversation is like saying yes or no. It leads to like better things coming your way and like the right things coming your way. It really does. That makes me want to ask you one of our last questions. This has been such a fun conversation, but it just feels like the right time to ask, what is one piece of advice you wish you could give your younger self and that could be like in your business or just in life, or both? I think one piece of advice always as I get older, I like think about this a lot like to just kind of like, put your blinders up and focus on you and to not compare yourself like some people can put on a facade of like, success, whatever that is, marriage, business, wealth, whatever.

  00:41:32  And to not compare yourself to just kind of like stay on your own journey and like blinders up, head down what is right and intuitive. For me, I just feel like whenever I get on a path of like comparing myself too much, I stray away so much from like, what I’m supposed to be doing that I go on this like an authentic path and I’m like, wait, how did I even get here? No wonder I’m not getting the results that I want and whatever thing that I want, because I wasn’t being intuitive. And it’s so hard to do with social media and just everything. But this is a piece of advice I need to continue to give myself. But just to kind of like stay on my own path and to be intuitive and to trust that, like when I listen to myself and do stuff that’s like for my highest and best self that like, everything works out for me. Everything goes my way. Yes. And that doesn’t mean like there won’t be challenges along the way.

  00:42:29  Like, I think challenges are just a normal part of life and they make you a better person and they help you see your blind spots. But like, I completely agree with you that when you cut out the comparison, which is hard on social media, and it’s also why the mute button exists, like you’re never going to offend someone with a mute button. They don’t even know that you’ve muted them, but that just helps you like put your blinders on and like really go inward and like, see, what do you want? You know? And people do put on these facades of wealth and I can tell you, like, I’ve worked behind the scenes in a lot of businesses beyond just social media, and I see what is really going on in people’s lives, and it’s not what they’re showing on social media. That doesn’t mean what they’re posting isn’t real, but it is important to just remember that there’s other things at play too that you may not know about. And knowing that alone helps you approach social media from a better lens.

  00:43:28  Like, that’s so cool. I know there’s other stuff going on in your life. Moving on. Yeah, I’m curious. Like recently, I like follow a bunch of other realtors just to support them, like people I know. But now it’s like I feel so bogged into feeling like I have to do all that stuff. And I’m like, I feel like I just need to meet all these people. Like, I mean, yeah, you’re on social media all the time. Like, do you feel like it’s easy to, like, stay away from trends or be authentic or, you know, yeah, it is hard until you decide not to care what they’re up to or you just mute them. And like, sometimes I go through phases where, like, I go through phases where I’m more insecure in myself or my business or whatever. And in those phases I really see myself like looking at other people’s pages, like, what are they doing? Like, why am I not doing as good as them? Whatever.

  00:44:21  And as soon as I catch myself, I’m like, whoa, mute, ignore. Like, what are we doing? That does not make sense? And then there’s times in my business where I feel really secure and confident in myself. And in that time it’s like, whatever, I don’t need to meet anybody. Like, I can see their content and know that I also have value. And I think that’s normal. Like, I don’t think you’re ever going to just choose a mindset and then never waver from that. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. So I think just being like often checking in with yourself and just saying, like, is it helpful for me to see this? Not really. Right now it’s actually hurting me. I’m going to mute them. I’ll come back when I’m comfortable again. And I think that’s okay. So the power of the meal I need to do that. Yeah, and I totally agree with it. You said like when I’m feeling like insecure and not as confident if I see other like realtors that are like killing it or getting so much engagement on their content.

  00:45:15  I’m like, oh, well, why isn’t that happening for me? When really, at least in Utah you can look up people’s stats, you can see how many transactions they’re doing, their volume, sales price, all that. I mean, a lot of these people, I can look up and I’m like, oh, wait, my business is way bigger than yours. And just to remember, oh my gosh, this other like realtor that I follow kills it on social media. And she’s got this like subset where she like sends people messages and stuff. I feel like it’s called a community I can’t remember. And she’s like, my business is so slow. And I’m like, my perception is that you are just killing it. And to remember, like just because somebody shows that they’re killing it or like that’s the perception that they want, which I’m not knocking. We all do that 100%. Everyone’s going to do it. But to know like that doesn’t actually equate to clients or sales or like growing your own business.

  00:46:09  It is so Hard. It’s so hard psychologically to understand that. But it’s true. Like when people say followers don’t equal sales, they mean that like it’s so true, I mean that, but it is so hard to really understand that because then you go look at their page and they have all these, all this stuff is going on and you’re like, well, they must be making hundreds of thousands of dollars. And it’s like, maybe not like maybe really, maybe not. And a lot of times not really know. And a lot of times not really. And you know, it’s different in your industry. But I feel like your bread and butter just is social media. But same thing like a coach social media, like you said, engagement and followers doesn’t mean that they have all this money or that they have all these clients. And I feel like it’s just hard now. Like as part of your brand, you have to show up and do all these things. But not everybody is perfect at social media and it should be a part of your business.

  00:47:12  But it is so hard to like kill it at your marketing, kill it on social media. Make sure you’re showing up for your clients in the right way. Have time for your family and friends. Workout. Make sure your hair is washed like all of these things like it is. Literally give yourself some grace. Yeah, it’s literally that meme, like a girlboss too close to the sun. Because while I think it’s so awesome that, like, we can own these businesses, girls or boys like no discrimination there, but it’s become so normal for us to all have these businesses. Like everyone I know is a business owner. It’s just crazy. And at the same time, when we took on that responsibility, we took on the responsibility of being our sales manager team, our marketers, our video editors were everything. And I think it is just sometimes important to take a step back and be like, I’m doing great. I’m doing my best. There’s always going to be people doing better than me.

  00:48:06  There’s always going to be people doing worse than me or We’re all going up and down and cycling through different phases of our business. And like, it’s not that normal to just always be crushing it. It’s not that normal. Most people just can’t operate at that level constantly unless they have a team of people behind them to help them, which, you know, hopefully we all get to that point where you can have that team and that is so crucial. Like that’s what makes us more successful. But and back to the entrepreneur thing. I feel like especially in Utah, there’s so many entrepreneurs. But whenever I think of entrepreneurs, I think of women. Like I think about so many women that I know that have their own business, that are killing it, and that can look so many different ways, like an obstetrician, my hair girl, you and cast, you know, like a tax accountant. There’s all these people that are running their own businesses and just killing it, these females. And I just love to see that, like in our community.

  00:49:04  And I feel like there’s so many like, amplifiers that are I might not, like buy from your business, but I support you and I will amplify your business. And you, I totally I’m obsessed with that. Like, there’s so many people that are in my community that like, maybe I’m not ready to work with them yet, or they’re just like, I don’t need what their offer is or whatever that like, I still love supporting and like they support me and I’m just like, hell yeah. Like we do all rise together. And I love that. That support is just amazing. And that’s honestly why I love social media, because the connections in the community, like, I can’t lie, they’ve literally changed my life. I’ve met some of my best friends there. My entire business runs on Instagram. Like I can’t help but be grateful for it. And I think if you’re not grateful for it, you’re probably no shame. But like, you’re using it wrong and you should shift how you look at it and how you use it.

  00:49:57  And I think maybe it’s not for them. And I think that is something that people need to be okay with. Like if you dread showing up on Instagram. Hiring someone to run your page isn’t going to help. Like, maybe you just don’t show up there. Like maybe you just don’t put your money into that. You can do other things. You can do other things because that’s just not authentic to you. And I’m sure you can speak so much to this. Like, yeah, you could run someone’s page and do it great and like do all the right things. But if they don’t show up with their voice and they’re not willing to like, you know, make their own videos or whatever, it’s just never going to be successful. It’s never going to like, lead to anything. And you don’t have to do it like that is something I tell people all the time. They’re like, I hate Instagram. I’m like, don’t do it either. Change your mind and go to a different place, look at it differently, or don’t use it like there’s so many businesses that don’t even have an Instagram account like, and they’re doing great.

  00:50:54  They’re doing great, they’re doing fine. Like they don’t need it. So you can be successful elsewhere. You don’t need it. I’m always going to advocate for it like hell yeah. It’s because I think it’s fun too. And I love it. Yeah, because I think it’s fun and I love it, and I love the community and connections. But yeah, you don’t have to use it. Yeah. Oh my goodness. This was such a fun conversation. I really loved everything we talked about. It was wonderful and I really appreciate you coming on here and sharing your knowledge with us. Yeah, thanks for having me. That was so fun. Yeah. Okay. We’ll talk to you later. Talk to you soon.

 00:51:26  First, I want to say thank you so much for being here and listening to my podcast. It means the world to me, and I just appreciate this community more than you could ever know. If you love this episode or a previous episode that you’ve listened to, go ahead and head to the.

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